25 Replies Latest reply: Sep 5, 2014 9:41 AM by RalphB _ RSS

    Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????

    ARICE01 _

      I used to make extensive use of .bat files to execute analysis using Monarch Pro.  For instruction, I somewhere found a short 3-page manual called "Using Monarch Command Lines" (2009 copy).  I have since upgraded to Monarch Pro 11.7 and am interested to know if there has been any updates to the  "Using Monarch Command Lines" manual, introducing some additional (hopefully, more useful) functionality.  Also, if anyone can provide me some example of .bat files which involves running a single Monarch .prj and .mod against several Excel files and exporting (using append) to a single Excel file,  I would appreciate getting a copy of the .bat  file so I can edit for my purpose.

       

      Thanks in advance.

        • Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
          Olly Bond

          Hello Arice,

           

          The End User Licence Agreement since Monarch 11.5 prohibits such automation. I think it's still technically possible, but you need to upgrade to a premium licence of Monarch to get it to work. There are threads here with links to the Programmer's Guide which contains a fuller reference about controlling Monarch using batch or COM, but Datawatch are keen for customers doing automation to get it off the desktop and onto a server.

           

          Best wishes,

           

          Olly

            • Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
              ARICE01 _

              Thanks Olly,

               

              I was not aware of the automation prohibition since 11.5.  I also posted my issue on the Datawatch Support site and very quickly got an email from sales wanting to sell me the full enterprise, server based Monarch/Data Pump upgrade.  Such investment would involve a huge bureacracy and take weeks.

               

              If anyone are using .bat command files with Monarch 11.7 (64-bit) in Windows 7, I would appreciate some advise how to make this work.

               

              Thanks,

                • Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                  Olly Bond

                  Hello Arice,

                   

                  Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I think since 11.6 the batch commands simply don't work unless you buy a $25,000 licence for a desktop version with automation support. If you hear any different, please do let me know. The combined server product of DataPump & Datawatch ES starts at $20,000 for a handful of users, so it's clear where Datawatch want everyone to migrate.

                   

                  One practical alternative is to search the reseller channels for any old 10.5 ... 11.5 boxed copies and buy them up - or even try eBay http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html/?_nkw=monarch%20software[/url] in case someone is selling off assets after a liquidation. Working in a bureaucracy myself, I suspect that this approach might not be much easier...

                   

                  Best wishes,

                   

                  Olly

              • Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                rlandeo _

                I learned that starting in the EULA for 11.5, they prohibit the use of scripting Monarch projects and any form of automation. I talked with a tech and supposedly, at the end of October they will be releasing Monarch v.12 in different versions; one of those versions will allow automation through scripting and with pricing that is closer to what we could pay for a license of Monarch, not Datapump.

                  • Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                    ARICE01 _

                    Thanks Raul:

                     

                    That will be great.  I am one of those who jump on all the new releases quickly expecting to enhance my productivity.  In retrospect, I should have waited for v.12, instead of v.11.7 (64-bit) which I am on now.  If scripting in available with the next desktop release, I will be compelled to upgrade again.  Hopefully, DW will be a bit more constrained in taking away critical functionality with future releases.  We will upgrade to the enterprise versions when the economy is a little better.

                     

                    I really appreciate all the good advice and support provided in the forum... Lets continue to support each other.

                      • Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                        RalphB _

                        Raul,

                         

                        If Monarch is asking as what Olly says of $25,000 for the automation add-on for V11.7, I would expect they would be asking the same for the automation add-on to V12 comes out in addition to the price of the program.

                          • Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                            adonis _

                            I have version 10.01 and live off the batch files.

                             

                            I was looking into getting the upgrades to many machines but if batch files can't be used, then what is the point to upgrade then?

                             

                            Can someone please confirm all above is correct, that you can't run simple batch file commands that older versions of monarch has had, which allows for using the tool to ie export into a database to perform intensive querying etc?

                             

                            please advise.

                             

                            This is not good.

                              • Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                Olly Bond

                                Hello Adonis,

                                 

                                There's no point upgrading desktop licences if you need to use batch files - but there is a point in talking to Datawatch sales to get some credit for the desktop licences and to make a move to Datawatch Server. Datawatch Server includes Datawatch ES and Panopticon, it may be more than you need. Datawatch Automator is what we used to know and love as DataPump. If you want some neutral, independent help to find the best option for you, do drop me a line.

                                 

                                Best wishes,

                                 

                                Olly

                                  • Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                    adonis _

                                    Thanks Olly

                                    not looking into a complex thing with servers etc.

                                    the main reason we used Monarch was for the ability to create end user computing solutions which are quicker then an IT solution or automation and for quick adjustments.  The best thing was you can export the data using the batch files and place the data into MS Access and the help file used to have all the parameters to help you achieve this.  If not available in newer upgrades, my feeling is that DW may take a hit because in this economy no one can pay 25k or some astronomical rate.  I recall licenses being about few hundred dollars back in the day and for a simple license it costs almost 2k because they include support which no one uses anyways.

                                     

                                    thanks for your efforts Olly, appreciate your efforts as always.

                                    have a great weekend.

                                      • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                        Trent Posey

                                        Adonis, we are using an older version as well and typically just use the export command line features. I'd love to know if you have the old 2009 list of all possible command line functions.


                                          • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                            RalphB _

                                            Trent,

                                             

                                            I have never seen any separate documentation about using command lines but if you click on Help on the Monarch Tool bar and then Help Topics you should see a chapter titled "Monarch Command Lines", chapter 9 in Monarch 10.5, which will give you a list of commands you can use.

                                             

                                            A long time user, Data Kruncher, set up a web site titled "Excel with Monarch" and in it he explained the command line options and how to use it.  In it he also has a "Batch File Generator" which some find useful.

                                             

                                            HTH.

                                              • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                Trent Posey

                                                Thanks so much!

                                                 

                                                Thank you,

                                                 

                                                 

                                                 

                                                 

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                                                  • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                    Olly Bond

                                                    Hello Trent,

                                                     

                                                    You can read a little bit more about Sandy Cavalaris (Data Kruncher) here: Sandy Cavalaris (DataKruncher)

                                                     

                                                    If you need a copy of the Programmers' Guide as a PDF, please drop me a line.

                                                     

                                                    As ever, standard disclaimers apply, automation belongs on servers not desktops, distributing the work can lead to chaotic and unsupportable libraries of unaudited scripts and models, sticking with old versions can cause Windows and Excel compatibility issues, and you miss out on all the good new features and functionality of new versions. If you'd like some neutral advice on the options, let me know.

                                                     

                                                    Best wishes,

                                                     

                                                    Olly

                                                      • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                        Kevin Kelly

                                                        Olly, no offence, but it doesn't really sound as if you're neutral, as you continuously appear to be pushing users back to the lastest, more expensive versoins of Monarch / Modeler.  it also seems that the latest and greatest versions of a software that was a joy to work with and which allowed a "poor man's programmer" such as myself, to automate some necessary tasks without having to be a "programmer type", has been removed and is now only available with a much more costly outlay.  I'm starting to wonder if there is another viable software solution to be used instead of this product.  It seems in the past, they were able to "empower" the standard Monarch / Modeler user, but that seems to have changed.

                                                         

                                                        Can you provide your association to Datawatch?  Are you an employee, or if not, tell us why your such a big fan?

                                                          • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                            Olly Bond

                                                            Hello Kevin,

                                                             

                                                            Thanks for your candid post - and no offence taken. It's nice to be given the chance to reply. For the record, Monarch Experts is a trading name of Greenbar Analytics Limited, and we are completely independent of Datawatch. Neither Greenbar Analytics, nor any of the Experts, hold any stock or options in Datawatch, and we don't receive any commission from Datawatch. As I posted here to a query from another user, if you run one copy of Monarch on a virtual XP machine for the next ten years, or deploy an enterprise-wide solution built on Datawatch Server, it makes no difference to us.

                                                             

                                                            I've been posting here and blogging about Monarch for a few years - www.greenbar.info is my site. I'm skeptical about the alternatives to Monarch - but you might find that some of the OEM vendors who whitelabel Monarch into their products still have desktop automation enabled.

                                                             

                                                            Whatever solution you adopt, Monarch Experts are here to help you if you need it. We offer strategy consulting for your reporting, a skills audit of your Monarch users, process documentation of your Monarch projects, and enterprise-level support of your models. If you want to go down the road of visualisation, we can help with that too.

                                                             

                                                            I'm planning a webinar on automation here in November. One of the topics I'll be loking at is how many automation requirements can be met in a single pass, now that exports based on key values, all filters, all summaries etc are possible, and the impact of the increase of the multi-column region to 100. You can do a heck of a lot in one project these days.

                                                             

                                                            Best wishes,

                                                             

                                                            Olly

                                                              • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                                Scott Warris

                                                                Hello, I've been using DataWatch's Monarch Pro for several years now starting with version 8 and I've migrated to the newer
                                                                versions as needed when I found features I wanted or as an OS change forced it.  I recently migrated my system from an XP Pro to Win 7 Pro and attempted to use version 10.5 which didn't load so I installed version 11 which I purchased awhile back but never installed.  Initially all of my models ran fine but a few days ago a few started to output incorrect information out of the blue and I found that some simple if statements were not functioning properly.  I tested these models back in version 10.5 and they worked
                                                                perfectly so I'm really puzzled as to why they just quit working in v11..  I've since contacted Datawatch and their solution is to migrate to Automator at a mere 25k+.....  I'm doing maybe 15-20 models so the cost far out weights the benefit so I don't see that as an option so I'm hoping someone can give me some advice on a work around or how I might remedy this without starting over with something else..

                                                                 

                                                                Thanks Scott

                                                                  • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                                    Olly Bond

                                                                    Hello Scott,

                                                                     

                                                                    You don't mention which version of v11? I'm aware of some timing issues with table loading up to about 11.4 which sound like what you're experiencing. And I guess that you have a need for automation, otherwise you could just deploy Modeler v12? Can you share the data and xmods so we can test whether it's dependent on hardware? Can you give us any idea of the scale of the data, in rows and columns, and how many external lookups do you have in one model?

                                                                     

                                                                    Best wishes,

                                                                     

                                                                    Olly

                                                                      • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                                        tfreeze _

                                                                        I'm not sure I followed this entire thread perfectly but think my question is related.  We currently automate with VBA in Access databases and are in the process of upgrading to Modeler.  Will we still be able to automate Modeler with VBA?

                                                                         

                                                                        Our current call looks like:

                                                                         

                                                                        Dim MonarchObj As Object
                                                                        Dim openfile, openmod, T As Boolean

                                                                        'If Monarch is currently active GetObject will use Monarch.  If not active, CreateObject() will open another copy of Monarch
                                                                        Set MonarchObj = GetObject("", "Monarch32")
                                                                        If MonarchObj Is Nothing Then
                                                                            Set MonarchObj = CreateObject("Monarch32")
                                                                        End If

                                                                        T = MonarchObj.SetLogFile("\\ccnp-fileprint\data\Investments\Pit\Monarch\Monarch log\MPrg_G6.log", False)

                                                                        openfile = MonarchObj.SetReportFile(strSourcePN & "U_TRN_STAT_F.txt", False)

                                                                        If openfile = True Then
                                                                            openmod = MonarchObj.SetModelFile(strMonarchPN & "Transaction Journal-AR Access upload.xmod")

                                                                        If openmod = True Then
                                                                        MonarchObj.CurrentFilter = "AR-Access-Gain-Loss-Inc pd-Inc3"
                                                                        MonarchObj.JetExportTable (strOutputPN & "Auto Recon.xls"), ("AutoRecon"), (0)

                                                                        End If


                                                                          • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                                            Olly Bond

                                                                            Hello TFreeze,

                                                                             

                                                                            No, this won't work on the evaluation version of Modeler, which doesn't support automation. There is a version of Modeler with automation enabled, but it costs more. I'd suggest contacting Datawatch Sales and asking them for a quote for a single user desktop licence of Modeler that supports automation, and a quote for Automator (which used to be known as DataPump). If you'd like some advice, please do reach out to me by email.

                                                                             

                                                                            Best wishes,

                                                                             

                                                                            Olly

                                              • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                ARICE01 _

                                                Hello All:

                                                 

                                                In light of my increasing need for Automation of Modeler v12.x actions, I requested a quote from Datawatch to upgrade my single user version of Modeler 12.3 to include automation capabilities, previously accomplished using batch command files.  As such enhanced capability is available, the price quote is quite high (5x) compared to the base Modeler Pro license cost.

                                                 

                                                Before I try to make the case to my boss for such substantial spend on a single user product, could someone(s) please provide me some feedback regarding your experience with the automation-enabled version of Modeler 12.x (called .com, I believe) that I may consider before taking this forward.  Do you feel the automation functionality is useful and powerful... and easy to use?  I am not a seasoned programmer and would hope that I can justify this spend base on productivity gains and expanded use of Modeler for other critical projects.

                                                 

                                                Thanks for any feedback you can provide...

                                                 

                                                Al

                                                • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                  joey

                                                  We have always used Data Pump (now Automator), and can automate most of our work that way. It has file monitoring and email notification, so it can work in a workflow pretty easily. However, we do have a few users who want the command line control.

                                                   

                                                  We're in the same boat as you. For the record, what is the version of Modeler that you requested the quote for the upgrade? If it weren't for forum posts on here, I would have had no idea there was even a version that supported automation.

                                                    • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                      ARICE01 _

                                                      Hi Joey:

                                                       

                                                      Thanks for your reply.  Yours is the only reply I have received, as I assume not many have purchased the automation add-on the Modeler.  I am using Modeler 12.0.5.2002.  I am reasonably ok with the functionality and keep my Datawatch maintenance paid up. I really need automation, but would like to know if others are using Modeler with the add-on.

                                                       

                                                      Thanks again...

                                                      Al

                                                        • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                          Olly Bond

                                                          Hello Al,

                                                           

                                                          Yes, Monarch Experts have got Modeler with automation and yes, we can support users with this deployment.

                                                           

                                                          I believe automation is best taken off the desktop and put on the server, but I recognise that lots of Monarch users struggle to make the case to their IT department to make that investment.

                                                           

                                                          Why is this? Well, Datawatch don't help much, removing the automation and not perhaps communicating a clear pricing structure and roadmap well enough. But users also struggle to clearly establish to their management the added value that Modeler brings.

                                                           

                                                          I've blogged on this at www.greenbar.info a while back, but I will revisit this in a month or two. In the meantime, if you'd like a chat about it, please feel free to reach out by mail.

                                                           

                                                          Best wishes,

                                                           

                                                          Olly

                                                      • Re: Updated Using Monarch Command Lines Instructions????
                                                        ARICE01 _

                                                        Thanks Olly

                                                         

                                                        I visited your www.greenbar.info site.  As a quick scan, I did not see your article re: Automation.  Note that I have asked my Datawatch rep if I can get a 30-day "evaluation version" of Automator for my stand alone Modeler Desktop v12.0.5 so I can do a proof of concept for the CIO.

                                                         

                                                        If Automator performs as expected, then I may be inclined request additional licenses to justify a server-based Datawatch environment.  Currently, there are many competing requirements for IT investment, and I do not want to put a major Datawatch investment proposal on the table at this point.

                                                         

                                                        You say you have Modeler with Automation.  What was your experience running Modeler/Automation on a stand alone pc?  Is the investment worth consideration?

                                                         

                                                        Your advice is much appreciated.

                                                         

                                                        Al